Cease FIRE!

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Cease FIRE!

Post by Guest » Mon Sep 13, 2004 7:50 pm

what exactly were the cease fire terms at the end of the war? i need this clarified for me and if anybody knows id greatly appreciate the answer. Thanks!
darren barnett
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Post by darren barnett » Sat Oct 15, 2005 12:22 pm

As far as I can recall the only terms were that Saddam would unconditionally withdraw all his troops from Kuwaitte and that we imposed a no-fly zone on his air force to protect Kurdish refugees from being gassed, srry that I can't offer more info. hope that helps.
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Post by darren barnett » Fri Jan 13, 2006 6:12 am

would you care to elaborate on that statement or is just another excuse to spam the casino link?
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Post by bilbo37 » Fri Jan 13, 2006 6:55 pm

I don't remember the conditions when it was over. Sorry I wished I could help
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Post by 2/6 CAV Trooper » Thu Oct 26, 2006 11:32 am

If I recall there were several conditions and terms worked out at the confrenece between General Schwartzkopf and the Iraqi Commander at Safwan Airfield, Coalition occupied Iraq at the end of hostilities. The Iraqi military had already fled Kuwait, but the terms of the cease fire involved Iraq's compliance with ther various UN resolutions which included compliance with UN WMD arms inspections which became an issue in the Desrt Fox when the inspectors were expelled and 2003 when Saddam was found in material breach of compliance. Other issues were the exchange of POWs, separation of forces, whther Iraqi use of helicopters would be regarded as a no fly breech, and other issues.

A question occurs to me on the cease fire location. Why was Safwan selected when we took the trouble of bring USS Missouri to the KTO and it has huge symbolic value and demonstrated value in conveying Allied military power to a humbled and defeated foe? While some of my unit's AH-64 Apaches were used to escort General Shwartzkopf's UH-60 Blackhawk, I think we would've gladly changed venues.
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Post by Dagger X-Ray » Thu Oct 26, 2006 4:04 pm

It has always been my understanding that we chose Safwan was due to its location inside Iraq but nowhere near the capital. Our job was to liberate Kuwait, not take control of Iraq BUT by still taking Safwan we showed that the rest of Iraq would not be a problem had we wanted to take it.

Bringing the mighty USS Missouri was most likely our way of saying "We Won and we know it whether you want to admit it or not". I believe at this point the US and coalition forces were ready for it to all end and it was going to happen one way or another.

To this day, I remember taking the radio call from Danger 6 for Dagger 6 announcing the cease fire. Within minutes we were tearing the TOC down and making a jump where we did not stop until we got to an area about a 1/4 mile away from the infamous "Highway to Hell".

Now that I think of it, not only did we bring up the Missouri but in both cases of the massive deaths on the highways (there were actually 2 "highways of hell", the other was about 60 miles of coastal hiway littered with destroyed Iraqi vehicles but not as famous as the inland one), its been claimed numerous times that those Iraqis were vacating Kuwait when we attacked them and destroyed them anyway. There has been some controversy over it but I don't think anyone ever got into any trouble over it.
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(9/90 - 12/91) 2nd Bde 1st Infantry Division - Desert Shield / Desert Storm Combat VET
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Post by 2/6 CAV Trooper » Fri Oct 27, 2006 12:24 pm

Dagger X-Ray, I understand what you're saying on selecting Safwan. It was a statement that the Coalition chose a location in Iraq to demonstrate Allied dominance. What surprised me to learn when reading General Shwartzkopf's memoir was that at hostilities end high command believed Safwan was in Coalition controlled territory only to learn that the area was scouted but not occupied and in fact was occupied by Saddam's forces and had to be driven out by a show of force.

If that was so I think it indicates what I now regard as an error in declaring the ceasefire for the political reasons of concerns over how the public would respond to images of "the highway of death" and the stated mission of evicting Saddam's forces from Kuwait having been achieved and not wanting to risk coalition casulties in the effort of more completely destroying the Republican Guard.
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Post by Dagger X-Ray » Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:23 pm

I have not read General Shwartzkopf's memoirs but am sure it would be an interesting read.

Safwan was where Col. Moreno (my brigade commander) had a face-to-face with an Iraqi Military official who refused to give up and leave. It wasn't until another face-to-face some time later that they agreed to leave after all of the 2-16th Inf, 3-37 & 4-37 Armors Tanks and Bradleys conveniently pulled up behind him...as a show of force.

I remember the atmosphere being very tense in the TOC that day, we piped all the radio chatter into the TOC for everyone to hear, many of the other BN commanders were on edge not knowing what was about to happen. It was like midnight on New Years Eve when the word came through they were leaving. Never saw so much brass smiling, jumping around, and hugging one another.

This "painting" is a loose interpretation of that standoff.

Image

I have all but given up trying to order one of these prints as the email on this painter no longer works.
Dagger X-Ray - ARMY
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(4/88 - 9/88) AIT Fort Gordon, Ga
(12/87 - 3/88) Basic Training Fort Jackson, SC
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
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Post by Dispacther » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:12 pm

Ft McClealan AL 09/83-11/83,
Ft Gordon GA 11/83-02/84
Ft Stewart GA 02/84-06/86
Binge drinking college student 06/86-10/88
N.C.N.G. 07/86-10/88
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HQ AFNorth 10/91-11/93
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Post by 2/6 CAV Trooper » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:29 pm

Wow nice image 8O

Dagger X-Ray, you're account seems to confirm Norm's. I hope someday you'll give it a read. I'm sure that your local library can get it for you. I also bought the audiobook version, as early on I tried to collect Desert Storm related books. I have Rich Lowry's Gulf War Chronicle on order and hope to have it in about two weeks. Norm confirmed for me that VII Corps (which my 2/6 CAV 11th AVN BDE was a Corp asset) was slow indeed slow in getting into motion during the start of the ground war.

Maybe you can tell me why the Iraqi forces were still in Safwan and the show of forces made necessary? I'm pleased to know the show worked without the need to exchange fire.
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Post by Dagger X-Ray » Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:01 pm

I hope account is close to his, I was there.

I assume the Iraqis were still there as Safwan is an Iraqi town so they most likely figured they were OK inside their own borders...WRONG. They also destoyed much of it and killed many of the people there. I have posted a few memories of Safwan amongst other posts here too.


Best as I can rememeber:
The Iraqis had orders to hold that town, they had nothing more than small arms to do so and when Col. Moreno drove up in his Hummer, he was met by an Iraqi Military Official and some Iraqi soldiers. They were told to leave and said they couldn't due to orders. The official had to get ahold of someone and inform them of the issue at hand. Seems Col. Moreno gave him a timeframe and once that timeframe was up, we were taking the town, they met again with the same need for a call to someone above him. After that, Col. Morenos last meeting with this official seemed to be a standstill also until some 65 Abrams and however many Bradleys all pulled up to the town about the same time = hat was Col. Moreno's "Show Of Force" you talk about. They promptly left.

We pulled into the town and setup for the rest of the day and through the night. It rained its butt off that night. This is where I watched a kitten turn down a "Ham & Chicken Loaf" MRE. The next day we moved to the AirField and setup on the end of the runway. I believe it was over the next few days that our mechanics setup the tents for the cease fire meeting. Other units setup tents also. One of the units drug 3 complete yet dead Iraqi tanks up to the backside of the tents (all 3 had taken Sabot rounds). 4th Brigade 1st ID positioned several Apaches on the runway and our armor units basically surrounded that area.

Here is a pic of an Apache sitting on the Safwar airfield sometime prior to the cease fire meeting:
Image


Here are 2 of the tanks behind the cease fire tents (sorry about quality of pic, it was a WalMart camera and had barely survived the war).
Image
Image



This is an aerial pic taken of the runway by a U-2 around the time of the cease fire. That was the only time there were that many people in that place at the same time. On a side note, Timothy VcVeigh is amongst those soldiers but was just another GI at this point. He was a 2/16th Infantry soldier.

The pic comes from this GlobalSecuirty website and it actually upside down.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/intell/li ... safwan.htm

I dislike this description of the Iraqi Surrender as it leaves all references to 1st Infantry Division, who actually did all the work, out of the timeline that led up to the cease fire. it only makes reference to events that led up to us taking Safwan.

Image[/img]
Dagger X-Ray - ARMY
(12/91 - present) - miss the service
(9/90 - 12/91) 2nd Bde 1st Infantry Division - Desert Shield / Desert Storm Combat VET
(9/88 - 9/90) C-17th Signal Battalion of 22nd Signal Brigade - Sachsenhausen Bar Scene VET
(4/88 - 9/88) AIT Fort Gordon, Ga
(12/87 - 3/88) Basic Training Fort Jackson, SC
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
-George Orwell
"I am a soldier, I fight where I am told, and I win where I fight."
- General George Patton
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Post by 2/6 CAV » Sat Oct 28, 2006 1:09 pm

Dagger X-Ray, I think I failed to rely my sentiments. I realize that you were there at Safwan. In Norm's account, during the realization that Safwan was still in Iraqi hands and the show of force, Norm was not there, but was telling his readers what the suituation was there from the commander's in the field. So it was Norm who was not there (until later) was not an eyewitness to the events in question as you were.

Thank you for the added details. As I recall it was the Big Red One that conducted the principle breaching operation for VII Corp and left signs at the border "Welcome to Iraq, courtesy of 1ID Big Red One."
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Post by Dagger X-Ray » Sat Oct 28, 2006 1:24 pm

Sorry, didn't mean to come off that way, meant to just detail as best as I can remember how things went. I used to have some of the "Welcome" sign pics but for the life of me have no idea where they went. We had one in Safwan also.
Dagger X-Ray - ARMY
(12/91 - present) - miss the service
(9/90 - 12/91) 2nd Bde 1st Infantry Division - Desert Shield / Desert Storm Combat VET
(9/88 - 9/90) C-17th Signal Battalion of 22nd Signal Brigade - Sachsenhausen Bar Scene VET
(4/88 - 9/88) AIT Fort Gordon, Ga
(12/87 - 3/88) Basic Training Fort Jackson, SC
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
-George Orwell
"I am a soldier, I fight where I am told, and I win where I fight."
- General George Patton
Image
Guest

Post by Guest » Mon Oct 30, 2006 11:14 am

Dagger X-Ray wrote:Sorry, didn't mean to come off that way, meant to just detail as best as I can remember how things went. I used to have some of the "Welcome" sign pics but for the life of me have no idea where they went. We had one in Safwan also.
No problem Dagger X-Ray. We're cool. 8)
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